[hpsdr] Hpsdr Digest, Vol 205, Issue 5
FRANCIS CARCIA
carcia at sbcglobal.net
Sun May 28 13:31:08 PDT 2023
Hi All,I have been using Hermes PS for years. You only need a relay on the rx to switch between the coupler and the main TR relay.I have not used my Atlas dual RX set up since I got Hermes. i have all the modules except the filter module and the PS module. I have over sized linear power supply modules mounted in the case and interfaced to an AC input. Time to go down the road. PM me if interested. Frank WA1GFZ
On Sunday, May 28, 2023 at 04:03:37 PM EDT, hpsdr-request at lists.openhpsdr.org <hpsdr-request at lists.openhpsdr.org> wrote:
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Today's Topics:
1. PureSignal for HPSDR/Penelope/Mercury (Michael Carey)
2. Re: PureSignal for HPSDR/Penelope/Mercury (George Byrkit)
3. Re: PureSignal for HPSDR/Penelope/Mercury (Jim Sanford)
4. Re: PureSignal for HPSDR/Penelope/Mercury
(laurence at nicklebyhouse.co.uk)
5. Re: PureSignal for HPSDR/Penelope/Mercury (George Byrkit)
6. Re: PureSignal for HPSDR/Penelope/Mercury (Helmut Oeller)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Sun, 28 May 2023 18:27:03 +0930
From: Michael Carey <michaelcarey at internode.on.net>
To: hpsdr at lists.openhpsdr.org
Subject: [hpsdr] PureSignal for HPSDR/Penelope/Mercury
Message-ID: <53a5ff05-0e98-1e9e-8035-e8e936c84e6f at internode.on.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; Format="flowed"
Hi Everybody,
Apologies if this has been asked/answered before... but is it possible
to use PureSignal on legacy HPSDR hardware?
I picked up a pre-loved HPSDR at a buy & sell weekend in late 2018
(Atlas, Metis, Penelope, Mercury, Excalibur, LPU and case). Firmware;
Metis 3.0, Mercury 3.4, Penelope 1.8.
I'm using the setup with a Codan 4404 400W HF amplifier with great
on-air reports. I tend to limit most activity to the medium power
setting on the 4404 (100W PEP). Certainly not as convenient as using my
Icom IC-7100 but it is a LOT more fun!
More recently I've been playing around with FreeDV and thought that
pre-distortion would help squeeze every Watt out of the amplifier with
the high duty cycle FreeDV modem transmissions, but I have noticed that
Disable Pure Signal is checked in Hardware Config and cannot be unchecked.
I understand that this is all legacy hardware but I'm wondering if using
PureSignal is possible.
73
Michael
VK5LN
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Message: 2
Date: Sun, 28 May 2023 07:44:31 -0400
From: "George Byrkit" <ghbyrkit at chartermi.net>
To: <hpsdr at lists.openhpsdr.org>
Subject: Re: [hpsdr] PureSignal for HPSDR/Penelope/Mercury
Message-ID: <036d01d99159$c52edd40$4f8c97c0$@chartermi.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
While it might be technically possible, there are lots of hurdles to
overcome, and PureSignal was not designed/implemented to work on the Mercury
receiver.
1) PureSignal needs an additional phase/clock-synchronous receiver channel
to get the feedback to correct the signal. Mercury only has ONE receiver
channel. You'd have to hand-stack multiple Mercury boards to begin with...
2) PureSignal needs more FPGA memory space for code and everything. A
Cyclone III doesn't really have that available for you.
3) perhaps bus timing and all are also in the way.
You should reach out to Dr Warren Pratt, NR0V, who implemented PureSignal.
73,
George Byrkit, K9TRV
-----Original Message-----
From: Hpsdr <hpsdr-bounces at lists.openhpsdr.org> On Behalf Of Michael Carey
Sent: Sunday, May 28, 2023 4:57 AM
To: hpsdr at lists.openhpsdr.org
Subject: [hpsdr] PureSignal for HPSDR/Penelope/Mercury
***** High Performance Software Defined Radio Discussion List *****
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Sun, 28 May 2023 09:12:11 -0400
From: Jim Sanford <wb4gcs at wb4gcs.org>
To: hpsdr at lists.openhpsdr.org
Subject: Re: [hpsdr] PureSignal for HPSDR/Penelope/Mercury
Message-ID: <7dc0ae18-b945-1fb0-0b51-0ebec24eff6a at wb4gcs.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
Good information, thanks.
I would GLADLY install a second Mercury to do this.? Since I have
everything referenced to GPSDO, I would think the phase matching would
be close.? Bus limitations would be an issue, no doubt. Would love to
see an attempt.
Wonder if a single Mercury could be set to switch to a receive input
coming off the PA sample port, only requiring 1 Mercury board.? (I THINK!)
Thanks & 73,
Jim
wb4gcs at amsat.org
On 5/28/2023 07:44, George Byrkit wrote:
> ***** High Performance Software Defined Radio Discussion List *****
>
> While it might be technically possible, there are lots of hurdles to
> overcome, and PureSignal was not designed/implemented to work on the Mercury
> receiver.
>
> 1) PureSignal needs an additional phase/clock-synchronous receiver channel
> to get the feedback to correct the signal. Mercury only has ONE receiver
> channel. You'd have to hand-stack multiple Mercury boards to begin with...
>
> 2) PureSignal needs more FPGA memory space for code and everything. A
> Cyclone III doesn't really have that available for you.
>
> 3) perhaps bus timing and all are also in the way.
>
> You should reach out to Dr Warren Pratt, NR0V, who implemented PureSignal.
>
> 73,
> George Byrkit, K9TRV
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Hpsdr <hpsdr-bounces at lists.openhpsdr.org> On Behalf Of Michael Carey
> Sent: Sunday, May 28, 2023 4:57 AM
> To: hpsdr at lists.openhpsdr.org
> Subject: [hpsdr] PureSignal for HPSDR/Penelope/Mercury
>
> ***** High Performance Software Defined Radio Discussion List *****
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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Message: 4
Date: Sun, 28 May 2023 14:41:17 +0100
From: <laurence at nicklebyhouse.co.uk>
To: <hpsdr at lists.openhpsdr.org>
Subject: Re: [hpsdr] PureSignal for HPSDR/Penelope/Mercury
Message-ID: <000001d9916a$14a88690$3df993b0$@nicklebyhouse.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
I don't think it is possible. The reason is:
Puresignal uses an ADC to digitise the amplified output; that bit is
possible with just one Mercury. It also needs a downconverted *digital*
sample stream from the upconverted digital TX signal, which would need the
TX board to fee out a downconverted signal - and as far as I know that isn't
possible.
Regards,
Laurence Barker
laurence at nicklebyhouse.co.uk
-----Original Message-----
From: Hpsdr <hpsdr-bounces at lists.openhpsdr.org> On Behalf Of George Byrkit
Sent: Sunday, May 28, 2023 12:45 PM
To: hpsdr at lists.openhpsdr.org
Subject: Re: [hpsdr] PureSignal for HPSDR/Penelope/Mercury
***** High Performance Software Defined Radio Discussion List *****
While it might be technically possible, there are lots of hurdles to
overcome, and PureSignal was not designed/implemented to work on the Mercury
receiver.
1) PureSignal needs an additional phase/clock-synchronous receiver channel
to get the feedback to correct the signal. Mercury only has ONE receiver
channel. You'd have to hand-stack multiple Mercury boards to begin with...
2) PureSignal needs more FPGA memory space for code and everything. A
Cyclone III doesn't really have that available for you.
3) perhaps bus timing and all are also in the way.
You should reach out to Dr Warren Pratt, NR0V, who implemented PureSignal.
73,
George Byrkit, K9TRV
-----Original Message-----
From: Hpsdr <hpsdr-bounces at lists.openhpsdr.org> On Behalf Of Michael Carey
Sent: Sunday, May 28, 2023 4:57 AM
To: hpsdr at lists.openhpsdr.org
Subject: [hpsdr] PureSignal for HPSDR/Penelope/Mercury
***** High Performance Software Defined Radio Discussion List *****
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To post msg: hpsdr at openhpsdr.org
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------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Sun, 28 May 2023 09:43:16 -0400
From: "George Byrkit" <ghbyrkit at chartermi.net>
To: <wb4gcs at amsat.org>, <hpsdr at lists.openhpsdr.org>
Subject: Re: [hpsdr] PureSignal for HPSDR/Penelope/Mercury
Message-ID: <037401d9916a$5b5f3f70$121dbe50$@chartermi.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Jim,
(no disrespect meant...)
I think that you would discover that it is way more than a second Mercury being plugged in. This was discussed on this list in the far-distant-past (like before 2015?) That's roughly when this was all discussed. I think that by reading the archives (if they are intact), you will answer your own questions.
This would be for you to attempt, I think. Don't hold your breath for others to try.
73,
George K9TRV
-----Original Message-----
From: Hpsdr <hpsdr-bounces at lists.openhpsdr.org> On Behalf Of Jim Sanford
Sent: Sunday, May 28, 2023 9:12 AM
To: hpsdr at lists.openhpsdr.org
Subject: Re: [hpsdr] PureSignal for HPSDR/Penelope/Mercury
***** High Performance Software Defined Radio Discussion List *****
Good information, thanks.
I would GLADLY install a second Mercury to do this. Since I have
everything referenced to GPSDO, I would think the phase matching would
be close. Bus limitations would be an issue, no doubt. Would love to
see an attempt.
Wonder if a single Mercury could be set to switch to a receive input
coming off the PA sample port, only requiring 1 Mercury board. (I THINK!)
Thanks & 73,
Jim
wb4gcs at amsat.org
On 5/28/2023 07:44, George Byrkit wrote:
> ***** High Performance Software Defined Radio Discussion List *****
>
> While it might be technically possible, there are lots of hurdles to
> overcome, and PureSignal was not designed/implemented to work on the Mercury
> receiver.
>
> 1) PureSignal needs an additional phase/clock-synchronous receiver channel
> to get the feedback to correct the signal. Mercury only has ONE receiver
> channel. You'd have to hand-stack multiple Mercury boards to begin with...
>
> 2) PureSignal needs more FPGA memory space for code and everything. A
> Cyclone III doesn't really have that available for you.
>
> 3) perhaps bus timing and all are also in the way.
>
> You should reach out to Dr Warren Pratt, NR0V, who implemented PureSignal.
>
> 73,
> George Byrkit, K9TRV
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Hpsdr <hpsdr-bounces at lists.openhpsdr.org> On Behalf Of Michael Carey
> Sent: Sunday, May 28, 2023 4:57 AM
> To: hpsdr at lists.openhpsdr.org
> Subject: [hpsdr] PureSignal for HPSDR/Penelope/Mercury
>
> ***** High Performance Software Defined Radio Discussion List *****
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> HPSDR Discussion List
> To post msg: hpsdr at openhpsdr.org
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> Archives: http://lists.openhpsdr.org/pipermail/hpsdr-openhpsdr.org/
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------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Sun, 28 May 2023 17:14:44 +0200
From: Helmut Oeller <dc6ny at gmx.de>
To: hpsdr at lists.openhpsdr.org
Subject: Re: [hpsdr] PureSignal for HPSDR/Penelope/Mercury
Message-ID: <2c7a17f5-5277-3608-63d8-b8fdadda6336 at gmx.de>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
Hi,
the development of PS started more than 10 years ago and was set up for
the Hermes board. Note that Hermes has only 1 physical frontend, but the
large FPGA? can contain several DDCs (digital down converter), which are
simultaneously fed on the ADC data. A common sampling oscillator
supplies the ADC as well as the DAC, i.e coherence is given.
George nicely listed all important reasons, why Atlas based HPSDR boards
can't use PS together with PowerSDR PS or Thetis. Nevertheless FYI: My
friend HB9EPU, an exceptionally gifted coder operates his own algorithm
of digital predistortion successfully using 2 Mercuries and a Penelope.
Minor Hardware mods for coherence were necessary, but the whole setup
runs in his individual Linux environment. All is possible, hi.
73, Helmut, DC6NY
Am 28.05.2023 um 15:12 schrieb Jim Sanford:
> ***** High Performance Software Defined Radio Discussion List *****
>
> Good information, thanks.
>
> I would GLADLY install a second Mercury to do this.? Since I have
> everything referenced to GPSDO, I would think the phase matching would
> be close.? Bus limitations would be an issue, no doubt. Would love to
> see an attempt.
>
> Wonder if a single Mercury could be set to switch to a receive input
> coming off the PA sample port, only requiring 1 Mercury board.? (I
> THINK!)
>
> Thanks & 73,
>
> Jim
>
> wb4gcs at amsat.org
>
>
> On 5/28/2023 07:44, George Byrkit wrote:
>> ***** High Performance Software Defined Radio Discussion List *****
>>
>> While it might be technically possible, there are lots of hurdles to
>> overcome, and PureSignal was not designed/implemented to work on the
>> Mercury
>> receiver.
>>
>> 1) PureSignal needs an additional phase/clock-synchronous receiver
>> channel
>> to get the feedback to correct the signal.? Mercury only has ONE
>> receiver
>> channel.? You'd have to hand-stack multiple Mercury boards to begin
>> with...
>>
>> 2) PureSignal needs more FPGA memory space for code and everything.? A
>> Cyclone III doesn't really have that available for you.
>>
>> 3) perhaps bus timing and all are also in the way.
>>
>> You should reach out to Dr Warren Pratt, NR0V, who implemented
>> PureSignal.
>>
>> 73,
>> George Byrkit, K9TRV
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Hpsdr <hpsdr-bounces at lists.openhpsdr.org> On Behalf Of Michael
>> Carey
>> Sent: Sunday, May 28, 2023 4:57 AM
>> To: hpsdr at lists.openhpsdr.org
>> Subject: [hpsdr] PureSignal for HPSDR/Penelope/Mercury
>>
>> ***** High Performance Software Defined Radio Discussion List *****
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> HPSDR Discussion List
>> To post msg: hpsdr at openhpsdr.org
>> Subscription help:
>> http://lists.openhpsdr.org/listinfo.cgi/hpsdr-openhpsdr.org
>> HPSDR web page: http://openhpsdr.org
>> Archives: http://lists.openhpsdr.org/pipermail/hpsdr-openhpsdr.org/
>
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