[hpsdr] Call for Comments and Discussion - OzyII

Henry Vredegoor henry.vredegoor at gmail.com
Wed Jul 22 01:50:31 PDT 2009


Hi Murray,

Well this is a whole different beast......
A USB/Ethernet concentrator (Router)

I think it has a uproc on board and yes...

It requires drivers or at least configuration software to be
configured/installed!

And I think it's way out of our league pricewise... :-( 
And yet another box.....

In my posts I was talking about USB-stick sized USB-to-Ethernet adapters and
you would also stick them just like an USB-stick into an USB port.

They need an OS/host to work and you need to install driver software on that
host. 

73's,

Henry.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: hpsdr-bounces at lists.openhpsdr.org 
> [mailto:hpsdr-bounces at lists.openhpsdr.org] On Behalf Of Murray Lang
> Sent: woensdag 22 juli 2009 10:32
> To: hpsdr at lists.openhpsdr.org
> Subject: Re: [hpsdr] Call for Comments and Discussion - OzyII
> 
> 
> ***** High Performance Software Defined Radio Discussion List *****
> 
> Here's one: http://www.bb-europe.com/product_family.asp?FamilyId=528
> 
> Can't vouch for it or anything.
> 
> Murray
> 
> Henry Vredegoor wrote:
> > Hi Murray,
> >
> > I was under the impression that they needed 
> drivers/software in the host for
> > that?
> > That it was only the PHY hardware (I think) in the adapter?
> > Maybe the latest don't need this anymore I'll have to check.
> >
> > More reading...... ;-)
> >
> >
> > Henry.
> >
> >   
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: hpsdr-bounces at lists.openhpsdr.org 
> >> [mailto:hpsdr-bounces at lists.openhpsdr.org] On Behalf Of Murray Lang
> >> Sent: woensdag 22 juli 2009 10:14
> >> To: hpsdr at lists.openhpsdr.org
> >> Subject: Re: [hpsdr] Call for Comments and Discussion - OzyII
> >>
> >>
> >> ***** High Performance Software Defined Radio Discussion List *****
> >>
> >> Hi Henry,
> >>
> >> You can buy USB to Ethernet converters (with TCP/IP) off the 
> >> shelf. Will 
> >> they work for HPSDR? Dunno. If so then you can remote 
> HPSDR right now 
> >> without a computer.
> >>
> >> Murray VK6HL
> >>
> >> Henry Vredegoor wrote:
> >>     
> >>> ***** High Performance Software Defined Radio Discussion 
> List *****
> >>>
> >>> Hi Larry,All,
> >>>
> >>> I like to disagree.
> >>>
> >>> Having for instance your own remote controlled radio's at 
> >>>       
> >> remote sites
> >>     
> >>> connected via the internet would require a PC at each site.
> >>> Not a cheap and keep-it-simple solution.
> >>> Also think of power requirements at remote sites or 
> >>>       
> >> portable/mobile use that
> >>     
> >>> you would like to keep low.
> >>>
> >>> Having to (remote) hassle with routing or configuration 
> >>>       
> >> setups at remote
> >>     
> >>> sites without having access to the full functionality that 
> >>>       
> >> TCP/IP/Linux(or
> >>     
> >>> other OS) offers is difficult, not to say a p.i.t.a. 
> >>>
> >>> I think not to implement the possibility of a full TCP/IP 
> >>>       
> >> stack if it could
> >>     
> >>> be done at a reasonable price would be a missed chance for 
> >>>       
> >> future (remote)
> >>     
> >>> applications of HPSDR.
> >>> And if you don't want to use TCP/IP, you could simply 
> configure the
> >>> OzyII/radio to use only Ethernet or just what layers you want.
> >>> It should maybe also have one or more USB interfaces for 
> >>>       
> >> legacy reasons or
> >>     
> >>> peoples preferences for that matter.
> >>>
> >>> I think it won't make that much of a difference in hardware 
> >>>       
> >> costs once you
> >>     
> >>> decided to use a modern capable processor or maybe even 
> >>>       
> >> better use/integrate
> >>     
> >>> a ready made small and cheap microprocessor-board.
> >>> Like you said there are a bunch of them around, but 
> >>>       
> >> integration into Ozy and
> >>     
> >>> adapt that combo to the specifics of our HPSDR hardware 
> >>>       
> >> would make it "more
> >>     
> >>> than the sum of parts" IMHO.
> >>>
> >>> I agree with you and others that OzyII should do the task as a
> >>> communications processor only, no other frills and thrills.
> >>> Maybe I confused people on this by mentioning the 
> >>>       
> >> BeagleBoard as an example
> >>     
> >>> for a plug-in microprocessor board for a test setup.
> >>>
> >>> 73's,
> >>>
> >>> Henry.
> >>>
> >>>   
> >>>       
> >>>> -----Original Message-----
> >>>> From: hpsdr-bounces at lists.openhpsdr.org 
> >>>> [mailto:hpsdr-bounces at lists.openhpsdr.org] On Behalf Of 
> >>>>         
> >> Larry Gadallah
> >>     
> >>>> Sent: woensdag 22 juli 2009 7:53
> >>>> To: hpsdr at lists.openhpsdr.org
> >>>> Subject: Re: [hpsdr] Call for Comments and Discussion - OzyII
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> ***** High Performance Software Defined Radio Discussion 
> List *****
> >>>>
> >>>> 2009/7/21 Paul Cecil <bikerpaul at suscom-maine.net>:
> >>>>     
> >>>>         
> >>>>> As I said there are a lot of great ideas being voiced but I 
> >>>>>       
> >>>>>           
> >>>> am afraid that
> >>>>     
> >>>>         
> >>>>> OZY II will become infected with "bloat", and the attempt 
> >>>>>       
> >>>>>           
> >>>> will be made to
> >>>>     
> >>>>         
> >>>>> make it a do everything card. If we make it too complex 
> >>>>>       
> >>>>>           
> >>>> then that can delay
> >>>>     
> >>>>         
> >>>>> its release, and in the end make it too expensive. And with 
> >>>>>       
> >>>>>           
> >>>> that thought we
> >>>>     
> >>>>         
> >>>>> need to keep this in mind. If we want to see more people 
> >>>>>       
> >>>>>           
> >>>> involved with HPSDR
> >>>>     
> >>>>         
> >>>>> then we will need to watch our costs. We have all seen the 
> >>>>>       
> >>>>>           
> >>>> "HPSDR boards for
> >>>>     
> >>>>         
> >>>>> sale" ads that have popped up. And a number have admitted 
> >>>>>       
> >>>>>           
> >>>> the additional
> >>>>     
> >>>>         
> >>>>> expense to complete the HPSDR to a usable radio was one of 
> >>>>>       
> >>>>>           
> >>>> the factors. Just
> >>>>     
> >>>>         
> >>>>> something else to think about.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Lets keep OZY II simple!
> >>>>>
> >>>>>       
> >>>>>           
> >>>> I also agree with Paul. There is a famous quote 
> somewhere that goes
> >>>> something like "simplicity is the ultimate 
> >>>>         
> >> sophistication...". In my
> >>     
> >>>> humble opinion, a significant detraction from many of 
> the currently
> >>>> shipping SDRs is the heavy reliance on a stack of 
> >>>>         
> >> (sometimes unstable)
> >>     
> >>>> USB hardware and software. If there is a faster, cleaner 
> way to get
> >>>> data from the ADC/CIC into a user's computer where the 
> interesting
> >>>> processing is going to happen, I'm all for it. I also 
> >>>>         
> >> suspect that the
> >>     
> >>>> more complex the FPGA code and logic becomes, the less 
> >>>>         
> >> likely people
> >>     
> >>>> are going to understand it and modify and innovate with it.
> >>>>
> >>>> I concur with all of the comments about being able to 
> "remote" the
> >>>> receiver "head" using Ethernet, and it is indeed much more 
> >>>>         
> >> flexible to
> >>     
> >>>> be able to do a bunch of TCP/IP plumbing to route data 
> >>>>         
> >> here and there,
> >>     
> >>>> but I don't think the TCP/IP stack needs to be in the 
> radio itself.
> >>>> The radio can communicate with the host computer using 
> Ethernet MAC
> >>>> frames, and the host computer can talk to the rest of 
> the world via
> >>>> TCP/IP (on a separate interface if need be). Computing 
> >>>>         
> >> appliances of
> >>     
> >>>> every kind that speak TCP/IP are now ubiquitous and cheap, and
> >>>> available in any imaginable format. We don't need to 
> >>>>         
> >> re-invent another
> >>     
> >>>> one here.
> >>>>
> >>>> We would do well to remember the time-tested UNIX philosophy for
> >>>> partitioning work amongst modules: Do only one thing, and 
> >>>>         
> >> do it well.
> >>     
> >>>> Cheers,
> >>>> -- 
> >>>> Larry Gadallah, VE6VQ/W7                          lgadallah 
> >>>> AT gmail DOT com
> >>>> PGP Sig: 917E DDB7 C911 9EC1 0CD9  C06B 06C4 835F 0BB8 7336
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