[hpsdr] Call for Comments and Discussion - OzyII
Henry Vredegoor
henry.vredegoor at gmail.com
Wed Jul 22 01:54:03 PDT 2009
Hi Murray,
Since we don't have an OS in our HPSDR setup these won't work for HPSDR. (
yet? ;-) )
Henry.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: hpsdr-bounces at lists.openhpsdr.org
> [mailto:hpsdr-bounces at lists.openhpsdr.org] On Behalf Of Murray Lang
> Sent: woensdag 22 juli 2009 10:48
> To: hpsdr at lists.openhpsdr.org
> Subject: Re: [hpsdr] Call for Comments and Discussion - OzyII
>
>
> ***** High Performance Software Defined Radio Discussion List *****
>
> Actually, that's kind of pricey. This one:
> http://www.eltima.com/products/usb-over-ethernet/ looks like a dufus
> that sits at the USB device end while the PC end just has a
> driver. Not
> sure if I'm interpreting that correctly, or if it will work
> for us, but
> it's certainly a lot cheaper than my previous suggestion.
>
> Murray
>
> Murray Lang wrote:
> > ***** High Performance Software Defined Radio Discussion List *****
> >
> > Here's one: http://www.bb-europe.com/product_family.asp?FamilyId=528
> >
> > Can't vouch for it or anything.
> >
> > Murray
> >
> > Henry Vredegoor wrote:
> >> Hi Murray,
> >>
> >> I was under the impression that they needed
> drivers/software in the
> >> host for
> >> that?
> >> That it was only the PHY hardware (I think) in the adapter?
> >> Maybe the latest don't need this anymore I'll have to check.
> >>
> >> More reading...... ;-)
> >>
> >>
> >> Henry.
> >>
> >>
> >>> -----Original Message-----
> >>> From: hpsdr-bounces at lists.openhpsdr.org
> >>> [mailto:hpsdr-bounces at lists.openhpsdr.org] On Behalf Of
> Murray Lang
> >>> Sent: woensdag 22 juli 2009 10:14
> >>> To: hpsdr at lists.openhpsdr.org
> >>> Subject: Re: [hpsdr] Call for Comments and Discussion - OzyII
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> ***** High Performance Software Defined Radio Discussion
> List *****
> >>>
> >>> Hi Henry,
> >>>
> >>> You can buy USB to Ethernet converters (with TCP/IP) off
> the shelf.
> >>> Will they work for HPSDR? Dunno. If so then you can remote HPSDR
> >>> right now without a computer.
> >>>
> >>> Murray VK6HL
> >>>
> >>> Henry Vredegoor wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> ***** High Performance Software Defined Radio Discussion
> List *****
> >>>>
> >>>> Hi Larry,All,
> >>>>
> >>>> I like to disagree.
> >>>>
> >>>> Having for instance your own remote controlled radio's at
> >>> remote sites
> >>>
> >>>> connected via the internet would require a PC at each site.
> >>>> Not a cheap and keep-it-simple solution.
> >>>> Also think of power requirements at remote sites or
> >>> portable/mobile use that
> >>>
> >>>> you would like to keep low.
> >>>>
> >>>> Having to (remote) hassle with routing or configuration
> >>> setups at remote
> >>>
> >>>> sites without having access to the full functionality that
> >>> TCP/IP/Linux(or
> >>>
> >>>> other OS) offers is difficult, not to say a p.i.t.a.
> >>>> I think not to implement the possibility of a full TCP/IP
> >>> stack if it could
> >>>
> >>>> be done at a reasonable price would be a missed chance for
> >>> future (remote)
> >>>
> >>>> applications of HPSDR.
> >>>> And if you don't want to use TCP/IP, you could simply
> configure the
> >>>> OzyII/radio to use only Ethernet or just what layers you want.
> >>>> It should maybe also have one or more USB interfaces for
> >>> legacy reasons or
> >>>
> >>>> peoples preferences for that matter.
> >>>>
> >>>> I think it won't make that much of a difference in
> hardware
> >>> costs once you
> >>>
> >>>> decided to use a modern capable processor or maybe even
> >>> better use/integrate
> >>>
> >>>> a ready made small and cheap microprocessor-board.
> >>>> Like you said there are a bunch of them around, but
> >>> integration into Ozy and
> >>>
> >>>> adapt that combo to the specifics of our HPSDR hardware
> >>> would make it "more
> >>>
> >>>> than the sum of parts" IMHO.
> >>>>
> >>>> I agree with you and others that OzyII should do the task as a
> >>>> communications processor only, no other frills and thrills.
> >>>> Maybe I confused people on this by mentioning the
> >>> BeagleBoard as an example
> >>>
> >>>> for a plug-in microprocessor board for a test setup.
> >>>>
> >>>> 73's,
> >>>>
> >>>> Henry.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>> -----Original Message-----
> >>>>> From: hpsdr-bounces at lists.openhpsdr.org
> >>>>> [mailto:hpsdr-bounces at lists.openhpsdr.org] On Behalf Of
> >>> Larry Gadallah
> >>>
> >>>>> Sent: woensdag 22 juli 2009 7:53
> >>>>> To: hpsdr at lists.openhpsdr.org
> >>>>> Subject: Re: [hpsdr] Call for Comments and Discussion - OzyII
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> ***** High Performance Software Defined Radio
> Discussion List *****
> >>>>>
> >>>>> 2009/7/21 Paul Cecil <bikerpaul at suscom-maine.net>:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> As I said there are a lot of great ideas being voiced
> but I
> >>>>>>
> >>>>> am afraid that
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> OZY II will become infected with "bloat", and the
> attempt
> >>>>>>
> >>>>> will be made to
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> make it a do everything card. If we make it too complex
> >>>>>>
> >>>>> then that can delay
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> its release, and in the end make it too expensive. And
> with
> >>>>>>
> >>>>> that thought we
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> need to keep this in mind. If we want to see more people
> >>>>>>
> >>>>> involved with HPSDR
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> then we will need to watch our costs. We have all seen
> the
> >>>>>>
> >>>>> "HPSDR boards for
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> sale" ads that have popped up. And a number have
> admitted
> >>>>>>
> >>>>> the additional
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> expense to complete the HPSDR to a usable radio was
> one of
> >>>>>>
> >>>>> the factors. Just
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> something else to think about.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Lets keep OZY II simple!
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>> I also agree with Paul. There is a famous quote
> somewhere that goes
> >>>>> something like "simplicity is the ultimate
> >>> sophistication...". In my
> >>>
> >>>>> humble opinion, a significant detraction from many of
> the currently
> >>>>> shipping SDRs is the heavy reliance on a stack of
> >>> (sometimes unstable)
> >>>
> >>>>> USB hardware and software. If there is a faster,
> cleaner way to get
> >>>>> data from the ADC/CIC into a user's computer where the
> interesting
> >>>>> processing is going to happen, I'm all for it. I also
> >>> suspect that the
> >>>
> >>>>> more complex the FPGA code and logic becomes, the less
> >>> likely people
> >>>
> >>>>> are going to understand it and modify and innovate with it.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I concur with all of the comments about being able to
> "remote" the
> >>>>> receiver "head" using Ethernet, and it is indeed much
> more
> >>> flexible to
> >>>
> >>>>> be able to do a bunch of TCP/IP plumbing to route data
> >>> here and there,
> >>>
> >>>>> but I don't think the TCP/IP stack needs to be in the
> radio itself.
> >>>>> The radio can communicate with the host computer using
> Ethernet MAC
> >>>>> frames, and the host computer can talk to the rest of
> the world via
> >>>>> TCP/IP (on a separate interface if need be). Computing
> >>> appliances of
> >>>
> >>>>> every kind that speak TCP/IP are now ubiquitous and cheap, and
> >>>>> available in any imaginable format. We don't need to
> >>> re-invent another
> >>>
> >>>>> one here.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> We would do well to remember the time-tested UNIX philosophy for
> >>>>> partitioning work amongst modules: Do only one thing,
> and
> >>> do it well.
> >>>
> >>>>> Cheers,
> >>>>> --
> >>>>> Larry Gadallah, VE6VQ/W7 lgadallah AT
> >>>>> gmail DOT com
> >>>>> PGP Sig: 917E DDB7 C911 9EC1 0CD9 C06B 06C4 835F 0BB8 7336
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> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
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